GDE duplication is GO GO GO

Wow, amazing coincidence, 4 years to duplicate gets us to the election after this one. I can see a gala opening ceremony just before that election.

They’ll probably be promising to triplicate it then.

Whatever the rights and wrongs of this road, to have opened the GDE with only 1 lane and then within six months to decide that it needs 2 smacks of the very worst planning and politicking. The ridiculousness of this decision is simply stunning. I wouldn’t wish this current government and Stanhopeless on NSW!

No issue with what you are saying Caf. But I’ll defer to what the Canberra Times editorial said today – they were 100% on the money.

Of more concern right now (to me anyway) is that Mr Stanhope has used the Page 2 article to deny what that he said what he did at the meeting on 8 July (see post #45).

He’s as much as called me a liar. Even though there were another 10 people in the room (representing every Community Council) who heard it.

Gungahlin Al: “disappointing” for the residents of Gungahlin no doubt, but as someone who’s been involved in local government yourself you must admit that it is nonetheless a basic truth that the more money you spend in one place, the less there is available to spend elsewhere. I’m sure every community council would love an 8 lane concrete autobahn from their area to the city, but clearly that would require cuts elsewhere.

bigred: I have my doubts about the feasibility of light rail too, but your comment makes no sense – there would be more work for CFMEU members in building a light rail system than in duplicating an existing road.

Adza: Close, but read that link closer – it’s only roads over80km/h that have that rule (not “80km/h and over”). So in the ACT that means 90km/h and 100km/h roads.

Thumper: I’m not sure what that’s unconvincing – anyone who was looking could always see that the road was being built with a third and fourth lane in mind – eg between Gininderra Dr and Belconnen Way it’ll just be a matter of widening the existing carriageways towards the centre.

Thumper

I heard the same report this morning, and it was a terrible performance. His ability to twist the truth for his own political benefits was very poor today, and Mike called him out on it…

I don’t see Sonic in charge this time next year. But will the people of Canberra decide its time for a change?

Child-like Brendan Smyth is attacking Stanhope’s economic credentials concerning the GDE, however, all Smyth, a potential Treasurer in Zed’s government has on his resume is that he used to manage a small book shop.

Every time Smyth opens his mouth the ACT Liberals lose credibility.

Zed is doing a pretty good job so it is a shame that deadwood like Smyth is dragging him down.

Well said, peterh. Not great for the blood pressure either! Let’s just hope that it doesn’t take 212 years as reported … or even four.

: )

G-Fresh said :

peterh said :

or b) undertake when the B*st*rd won’t change out of the right hand lane.

Drivers aren’t obliged to change from the right lane to the left unless it is signposted as such i.e. on the Tuggeranong Parkway

Actually that’s incorrect. If the road is signposted as 80km/h or over as the speed limit, you are required to drive in the left hand lane whether or not it’s signposted to keep left. On roads less than 80km/h you are not required to keep left unless signposted.

This comes from Reg 130 of the Australian Road Rules: http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_reg/arr210/s130.html

peter@home said :

so where the hell is my dragway??

mutter, whinge, whinge mutter…

They’re building it!!! It’ll be right next to the current GDE 😉

I see the CFMEU lobbying has paid off. “Build more GDE and we will chip in for your election kitty”. No light rail this time guys. toot toot!

G-Fresh said :

peterh said :

or b) undertake when the B*st*rd won’t change out of the right hand lane.

Drivers aren’t obliged to change from the right lane to the left unless it is signposted as such i.e. on the Tuggeranong Parkway

agreed. but in the interest of safety, doing 50 in an 80 zone is going to cause a bit of concern to other drivers.

peterh said :

or b) undertake when the B*st*rd won’t change out of the right hand lane.

Drivers aren’t obliged to change from the right lane to the left unless it is signposted as such i.e. on the Tuggeranong Parkway

speaking as a southside resident, why don’t they just fix it?

most infuriating drive from mitchell today, stuck behind a tourist doing 50!!!!!

there are signs saying 80, obviously couldn’t discern 50 from 80! we need a second lane NOW, so I can either a) overtake, or b) undertake when the B*st*rd won’t change out of the right hand lane.

then, sitting at the lights in civic with a turn left any time after stopping, a P Plater sat there till the lights went green!! AAAARGH!

note to self: going to have to see anger managment counsellor again. drugs not working.

Speaking as a Gungahlin resident I am just happy that it’s being fixed, although I’m not looking forward to all that roadwork again. As far as anything else goes, it’s the timing, not the whinging, that has made the difference.

It’s not a surprise given there some some $78M in unallocated roads funding in the budget, that Andrew Barr as much as confirmed it at out GCC meeting a couple of months back (video here), and as Jonathon said further confirmed by Tony Gill just a few weeks ago.

Yet in all of that context, we had Mr Stanhope at his lunch with all Community Council reps stating categorically that:
“All the advice that I’m being given is that the extra lanes are not needed now, and won’t be for years.” He did say an “at least” number of years but I can’t remember it.

He went on to try a ‘divide and conquer’ tactic by banging on about “what road projects in other communities wouldn’t go ahead if we spent $90 million on the GDE – the Lanyon Drive upgrade, the……..” and so on. One road for every other Community Council at the meeting. It was a very disappointing ploy, and ironic in the light of yesterday’s announcement.

All that aside, it is good to see that Jon and John have finally conceded that everything we’ve all (inc RA) have been telling them from right back way before the job was finished was 100% correct. Despite the endless poo-pooing of all their critics.

These sort of bulls*t games make it hard for me to keep my respect levels up…

hey barracks, here’s a tip – go ten or fifteen minutes earlier or later than you do now, you’ll get a dream run. canberrans – where has our personal responsibility gone to and why do some of us have an inability to merge (the only points where i see “traffic”).

Well, there’s what drove the decision and then what drove the timing.

They could all think they’re telling the truth.

Basically polling told all sides there were a pile of Gungahlin votes in the issue and they had to own it.

hehehe… funny, Stanhope is now saying that the Opposition was leaked the Government’s plans to go to tender on the GDE duplication and in fact it was the Opposition that was copying, not the Government.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2008/07/24/2312788.htm

I don’t believe him

Indeed even though it was always planned to be duplicated later, parts have been done in a manner where it seems as if the current road will need to be re-aligned, the bit from Ginninderra Drive to Barton Highway for eg.

I don’t think that’s the case – looking at the plans as it was being built, it was pretty clear exactly where the duplication would go and how it would be hooked in to the existing road. I’m happy to be proved wrong, but for all the ineptness in not building a dual carridgeway in the first place, I don’t think they’re that inept…

sepi said :

I wonder what happened to the consultation John Hargreaves said he was going to do before he made any decision on this??

Hargreaves consulted with a couple of bottles of shiraz, and funnily enough, they told him that the GDE should be duplicated as soon as possible so as to avoid an avalanche of angry bastards voting against Labor in the next election.

Ahh well see this quote from the Canberra Times Article:

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news/local/news/general/stanhope-in-90m-uturn-on-gde/1225231.aspx

“The Save the Ridge lobby group fought a fierce legal battle to try to stop the GDE’s encroachment on the Bruce-O’Connor ridge. A former Save the Ridge member Allan Lohe said last night it was always clear by the amount of bush that was cleared that additional lanes would be built.

”But one lane or two lanes, the bush has been lost,” he said.

”It shows the stupidity of the Government. The road is going to cost something approaching $200million and for that they could have got a gold-plated light rail system.”

Another former member is Labor’s candidate for Molonglo, Mike Hettinger, who fought against the GDE. He was unaware of the Government’s announcement last night and would not comment.”

Ralph said :

So will the save the ridge NIMBYs and green luddites be uniting for another try on?

More roads makes gaia weep.

I received a brochure from Mike Hettinger (an ALP candidate for Molonglo) in the mail in O’Connor the other day. I’m a liberal but I followed his campaign fairly closely last time. He’s an interesting guy (it was between him and Barr in the countback).

He was involved with the Save the Ridge campaign. I guess reviving it could raise his profile again but really, I can’t see it happening. They got smashed last time so it would just be a waste of money.

The Canberra Times is reporting “Opposition Leader Zed Seselja was set to announce today that the Liberals would allocate $93million to upgrade the two-lane road into a four-lane parkway within 212 years if elected in October.”

Even the Canberra Times has stuffed up or the Liberals are really keen on long-term planning.

It’s a worry though, perhaps we will not have cars in the year 2220?

So will the save the ridge NIMBYs and green luddites be uniting for another try on?

More roads makes gaia weep.

I’m no fan of Sonic, but I don’t see it as such a big deal that it was not built dual carriageway in the first place. This would have been ideal, but for whatever reason the London Cct Soviet cried poor. Maybe it was the legal challenges or perhaps that “killer deficit” that never happened even though we all had our rates jacked up.

The M5 in Sydney was single lane each way for a number of years until finances caught up. It’s not ideal, but I think it’s just the way a lot of road projects are going to happen now.

That being said, Belconnen Way to Glenloch should have been dual carriageway from the start – it was an existing road that has been expected to cope with a lot more traffic. How hard would it have been to tidy up the existing Caswell Drive?

First up – how is it that some random RIOTer (JC) appears to be a better planning Minister than John FW Hagreaves? That post is one of the most sensible plans I’ve ever read.

I drive from Ngunnawal to Greenway every morning and back every night (barring weekends of course). The GDE has introduced something that was missing from Canberra for too long – Sydney peak-hour traffic.

I wish I could dig out the quotes of JH in the local rag – he stated words along the lines of “We’ll look at upgrading the GDE in the next 5-10 years” and “I was asked to build a link between Gungahlin and the Parkway, and I achieved that”.

I suppose that when it looks like you’ll be off to Centrelink in a few months’ time, you buck up your ideas, eh Johnny H?

Oh my how many people have short memories. The dupliction was foreshadowed in the budget a month or two back, so it should come as no surprise that it has now been formally annouced.

As for this whole shit fit, the road should never have been built the way it was. If money was an issue it should have been built backwards. That is Glenloch first, a dual carriage way to Belconnen Way then dual carriage way to the Barton Highway. Building a single lane from Gungahlin was just nonsene. Building the other way would have releived some of the other traffic trouble spots, such as Belconnen Way, Ginninderra drive etc, without intoducting more traffic onto an road not up to capacity.

As for taking 4 years, that is now 4 years everyone has to put up with reduced limits, which again makes a mockery of the whole thing. Indeed even though it was always planned to be duplicated later, parts have been done in a manner where it seems as if the current road will need to be re-aligned, the bit from Ginninderra Drive to Barton Highway for eg.

Yet another ACT road ballsup. It should have been dual carriageway from the beginning.

It’s only on a long list of other roads and traffic alterations which just leave the public going WTF?

So they will spend how much? And all for a single traveller who happens to live in Palmerston and work for centreflunk. What a waste.

You should be calling for the money to be spent on light rail instead. Or?

I told all you naysayers this was going to happen in a comment I left almost 2 weeks ago:

http://region.com.au/?p=7952 (comment #11)

Jonathon Reynolds said :

Those who travel southbound down the GDE between the Aranda off ramp and the Glenloch Interchange will be pleased to note that the road will soon be upgraded to dual carriageway or at least a pre-election announcement will be made that the upgrade will occur (the cynic in me is coming out again!).

Earlier this month I was attending a joint Community Councils meeting with ACT Government agencies (and their representatives) and Tony Gill – director of ACT Roads (TAMS) indicated to a number of us that there was money left in the kitty and available for the upgrade.

It sort of makes sense given that the southbound lane was in fact the the original “Caswell Drive”, so I suspect that it will be a simple mater of widening the verge to cater for the cyclist lobby (I think the minimum standard is 1.2m for on-road cycle lanes) and re-spraying new lane markings. I just do not understand why they didn’t make it dual lane in the first place when they were building the thing!

But what would I know? Apparently to some I am widely regarded as a bilious, self-regarding oddity that lurks around the northern edge of Canberra. :o)

Until he starts commenting here, sure.

Hey I want to attack Sonic because he is an arrogant arR$hole and I don’t care about his ideas. Is that OK?

Fair enough!

Good policy but I will miss them/it.

Maintain the rage…..nicely.

Attack the ideas, not the person espousing the ideas.

John, I guess you don’t really disappoint and I know it is for the future good but you must admit they were entertaining. Are there new rules in regard that sort of acidic banter or is it now just enforced?

Sorry to disappoint.

Feel free to set up the angry men’s shouting club website.

It’s difficult to disagree with the general dasappointment with the current GDE. Sonic and pals are soft sausages for not sticking to their guns and building the right road in the first place. Both sides are going to flap their chops on this one.

JB, I hope that excellent policy as stated above is what you are on about, because I am already disappointed in the moderation Nazi approach you have taken to some of the more robust discussion. With that said, I miss vg and Ingees social intercourse but I don’t miss their hostility and unnecessary abuse.

Actually I do miss their hostility.

Duplicating one section of road, soon after they finish building that part they will realise they need to duplicate the rest of it and also fix the entry and exit points along most of the route. It probably won’t be a worry for the bumbling idiots duo of Stanhope & Hargreaves, they’re unlikely to be in government anyway.

Because we’re not going to be the stooges of any party.

There are partisans here who clearly state where they’re coming from.

There are others who’ve worked long and hard to build a valid presence here.

But no-one from head office gets to just walk in and start throwing grenades at the expense of the rest of us.

And that requires judgment calls, and that’s what I’m being paid for which is why I’m back in front of a terminal at 8.46pm instead of watching spicks and specks.

Notwithstanding anyones alleged secret Liberal allegiances/fetish, all I can find on the ACT Labor website is a commitment in their 2007-08 policy document to complete the GDE by this year. The libs have a policy to complete it as it should have been done in the first place with two lanes. As long as they don’t buy anymore art..

I have a hunch that the delays in the completion of the half done GDE have more to do with poor project management by the ACT public service than any other reason.

Tom-Tom writes: “hey barracks whose office do you work out of? …with staffers like you its not wonder the libs are so inept. .hack.”

Barracks replies: “The question is what office are u from? U the nob who wrote the release re-promising to paint lines at Aranda?”

Why the heavy hand Johnboy? Looks about even to me, and much milder than other stuff on here.

My interests are that I want this road done. Happy to see both agree it will be done, but I don’t think line markings near the Aranda end is the best way to start.

Barracks,

You’re either affiliated with the Liberal party, or pretending to be to discredit them.

Either way you’re acting illegally in the manner of your posting, and abusing our other contributors.

Neither of which we tolerate.

So disclose your interests or cease now.

And cut out the abuse of other posters while you’re at it.

In relation to your content, the CM is still the in Government for some months now.

You’ll just have to deal with that.

An office in Tuggers actually, which is the sh*t right now because I have to drive from Palmerston. On a bad day in peak hour GDE takes me 40 to 50 minutes to do what should be a 10 min trip past Glenloch, BEFORE I even get onto the Parkway.

The question is what office are u from? U the nob who wrote the release re-promising to paint lines at Aranda? Like that might cut 2 minutes off my daily grind.

If you think there are any election policies on the Labor website, then post the link Mr Stanhope.

hey barracks whose office do you work out of?

might want to look under policies on the alp site.

with staffers like you its not wonder the libs are so inept.

hack.

Ask the Libs to promise a dragway and Stanhope will have one giftwrapped same day dude.

so where the hell is my dragway??

mutter, whinge, whinge mutter…

Try this link http://www.canberraliberals.org.au and check the policies bit

Couldn’t find any election policy on http://www.actlabor.org.au … so where does Stanhope file their full election promises for us to check out?

This is a crackup. I saw the City News today in its bundling showing the Lib announcement on GDE. It’s already printed.

And the Libs have a full policy on their website http://www.canberraliberals.org.au. Looks like Stanhope has panicked with his media release – no policy, not even a final number. Pretty lame to say he hasn’t worked out the final number yet. I guess he got burnt last time when he said it was $53 mill

Stanhope’s promise of $4 million for a “second lane” from Aranda is an old announcement they did a few weeks ago. That is just repainting the lines from further back after cars get off the road over Belconnen Way.

I love Captain Cranky’s line that

“Thanks to good project management, the road came in earlier than scheduled and within budget.”

Yeah right. The Lib policy says they promised 4 lanes by 2004 at $53 mill. I thought the road opened in April this year, not April 2004.

I’m guessing that internal polling happened to it.

I wonder what happened to the consultation John Hargreaves said he was going to do before he made any decision on this??

Thank God. That Aranda bridge bit is a scarily narrow stretch of two-way – an accident waiting to happen. Worst case scenario – a prang could cause a car to flip over onto the road below.

What a great idea, why didn’t we think of doing that, in the first place…

4 years? Is that longer then it took to build the whole thing originally? Also amazing what whinging AND an election year will do.

And given that the duplication process is starting only a few months after being fully open, the question must be asked how much extra money will this cost over building the damn thing as dual lane to begin with?

Aint going to stop ACT Light Rail and the Greens from complaining.

No Time!

What about light rail?